The American Civil War

[Tazzers]

At one point was it or was it not mooted that the Confederate States were in negotiations with the UK about Britain joining the war on the side of the CSA?

If it is true, why did it not happen?

I think I know why I wanted some other views.

[Whitey]

It was, but you guys left us hanging and now we are an economic colony of the North.

[Andy O'Pray]

The Glasgow tobacco barons partially financed the South, plus many Scots fought for the South, amongst them were some of my ancestors. Check the number of officers by the name of Greer.

Aye - Andy.

[Tab]

There many things involved in this, We were pressed by a lot of people in this country to take action against the North due to there blockade on Southern ports that was stopping the cotton getting to the Mills in the Midlands and causing mass unemployment. Luckily sounder minds said we should keep out of it. There was also a problem with William Wilberforce act about Anti Slavery, we had sent the RN to stop any ship on the high seas that they suspected to be a slaver from what ever country it was from including America. This had caused a storm of protest from America and it was mainly there own problems about and the protest from anti Slave people in America that kept the lid on the problem until the Civil war broke out then it was irrelevant to the North after that.

[Wholley]

There is no doubt that the British were bankrolling the South.
Not only the Glasgow connection but also arms deliveries via blockade runners.The Enfield rifle musket was "imported"on a regular basis,some had their locks stamped"LAC"meaning London Armoury Company.
Others had simply "Enfield Amoury"stamps.
There is also an Irish connection.Green dyed Irish Wool got through the blockade an was sewed into jackets worn by the 26th.Regiment North Carolina Troops.They wore them in the latter part of the war when transfered back to the ANV from the Army of the Mississipi and surrendered at Appomatox still wearing the Green.
I feel that British military intervention would have goaded the French
into sending troops to support the Yankee's.
I'm sure this is altogether too much information for most,so I'll shut up
Wholley.

[Whitey]

Yep, the South got used and abused, one of the saddest plights of a people in history. I saw a special that spoke of at the surrender at Appamatox Union soldiers came face to face with the Confederates and saw the enemy they fought for so long and so hard was a small band poorly fed, equipment deprived raggedy men. And people think these men sacraficed like this to keep blacks in cages. 90% of the Southern soldiers never owned a slave and lived in dirt floor shacks or Dogtrot houses.

Well atleast my uncle Al Sharpton can speak his mind now.

[nbforrest]

Without a doubt the British supported the South for economic reasons. One of the reasons the British didn't jump in was the slavery issue, to hear the Yankee revisionists tell it that was the only reason. There was a stong albiet minority abolitionist movement in Britain and the North that pushed for immediate and total emancipation of the American Negro, which considering the circumstances was not a very good idea. Brits it seems were divided as to the why of the war of northern aggression. John Stuart Mill believed that slavery was the only cause of the war. Dickens cut to the chase and recognized it as a tariff issue, apparently agreeing with that ape Lincoln who said that if it would preserve the 'Union' he would never free any slaves at all and that the war was over the tarriff. Most editorials in British papers saw the war for what it was, a failure of the North to uphold the democratic principle of self determinationand self government, and the use of force to maintain a union of which one party no longer cared to be a part. Kind of like beating your wife into agreeing to stay when she has sued for divorce

Enough of that, It seems I read somewhere and am looking through my library to find the reference that Russia parked a fleet of ships in New York harbor as a warning to the British to not get involved. Russia was having its own trouble with the Poles rebelling against that Monarchy. Fearing French and British intervention Russia sent its two fleets to San Francisco and New York. Northerners viewed this as a sign of solidarity. I cannot find but will continue to search for how the Bitish government viewed this move by Russia.

[Whitey]

I hate Russia. And Lincoln, and Yankees. I got a good story about today about a Russian I'll tell you.

[Andy O'Pray]

From what I have read there were many Scots who moved to the Southern USA after the amalgamation of the UK. They had a great mistrust of centralized government, having experienced being governed from London, thus their reasoning for fighting the Northern forces. As has been stated, the majority of the men in the Confederate army never owned a slave, most of them were only one step up from slavery, being indentured servants. As an interesting sideline. During a visit by some British diplomat to the Southern States, he noted that on some plantations the slaves only spoke Gaelic. I have lots of these bits of useless information which I will bore you with later, like how was the word Gringo used to describe Americans by the Mexicans.

Aye - Andy. :fadein:

[Tazzers]

Thanks chaps that was very informative. Andy don't forget that many Scots, my own family included, moved to other parts of the UK they didn't just travel overseas.

[JR]

Ahoy there, The CSS Alabama 1862-1864,Built for the Confederancy 1862 by John Laird and Co Liverpool,the Alabama was commisioned on the 24th August 1862 and during its two year career as commerce raider the Confederate Cruiser Claimed 60 Yankee prizes valued at $6,000,000,57 members of the ships company were recruited in Liverpool which at the time of the Civil war flew from prominent buildings the Stars and Bars.Aye JR

[Whitey]

The American Civil War was the first communist revolution. We are just like the socialist's now in law and stuff, except we got money and crap to buy. Nothing much more though.

[Frank S.]

Still, it beats having to grow a shaggy beard and wearing a djellabah and/or a kaffiyeh.

Just joshing, though: I hear ya.

[Whitey]

My problem isn't having stuff. I got alot of stuff, I got so much of it I call it Sh!t. No my issue is being told when I say something unpopular that I'm offensive, that guns are the next worse thing to OBL. That due process of law is only for millionairs and defendants who are admittedly guilty just making a story. I'd trade the 8 Swiffer mops, 38 boxes of cereal, the 25 plus candy bars and the new cars for States rights anyday. Our people are under some mystical spell, and seem to be programmed to react in a certian way. Take for instance, last night. I was at a store that was having this "Super" sale, people were lined up for a block to get in. It was cold, real cold, but my wife has just got to buy something you know. I have our son and I say Fuhg this and decide to go back to the warm car. As I step out of line a lady nicely says"You aren't going in, the sale is great?" and I jokingly say "No, this looks like a scene from the USSR in 1984 with people standing in the cold for shite paper." and she gets angry and says "My husband is Russian!" So I go to the car with my boy and wonder WTF does saying what I said have to do with her husband and pissing her off? Conclusion, she is mental.
Same at school, I say in class to answer a question on how to best conserve Americas resources we need to halt illegal immigration and use population control techniques. The class and professor call me a racist and demand an appology, I say how is that racist and to what am I sorry for? Conclusion, they are mental and I ain't sorry for having an opinion.
I'd rather have a shaggy beard than deal with this crap in exchange that I may buy some over priced made in China plastic object multiple times.
Some people think being able to buy crap at an interrest rate they can never pay-off is freedom, and is worth trading your spine for, I don't, but that is just me.

[Tazzers]

I had a run in with a bloke who works (I think) for Lockheed Martin who understandably has issues with any other aircraft not built by Lockheed Martin.

One day he showed a close up picture of a part of an aircraft (a Eurofighter Typhoon) and used it to imply that we in Europe (I use 'we in Europe advisedly because I am what is known as a Euro sceptic) cannot build aircraft as well as they can in the USA. It was a picture of an access hatch and for the life of me I couldn't figure out what the problem was or what he was trying to point out so I called him a racist.

He replied that I was a clown and what was racist about anything that he had said.

So I replied:

"You show a picture of a perfectly good aircraft and use it to imply that we don't know how to build aircraft and you do. Now tell me what is NOT racist about that?"

In short I know what you mean Whitey but lots of people are determined to speak their minds come rain or shine; and 'bugger!' political correctness or corperate brain washing. The only problem is that sometimes they might not be agreeing with us.