RM reserves, good or bad thing?

[Argonaught]

I was talking to friend of mine who is joining the RM reserves and i thought good on him.
After thinking about it for a while i thought he is going to be doing this one day a week and he will have the same green beret as i will hopefully get, im not sure what they get upto in the reserves or if they are every really involved in any conflicts but this dosent seem right to me, mabey my understanding of the situation is wrong, any comments?
The second part of my question, is there a need for the RM reserves as in the Falklands
only 50% of the marines were used, battles seem to be downsizing and requiring different skills, so are they still needed to make up the numbers?
The third part of this question is would you give a reserve any real respect or resonsibilities in a battle situation, would you trust some one who learnt there skills on a part time basis to do the job of a RM?
Intrested to see what you guys think, and if you have ever worked with reserves.

[Yorkie Malone]

Look in Photos Rouges gallery down to 8 Troop Zulu Coy 45 CDO...

Pick out the two (2) RMR lads.

They did the same job as the rest of them.

[Calum]

Just to reply to the first part of your question. As a reserve you do only train one night a week and every second weekend or so (during training), and at the end you will earn the right to wear the Green Beret, just as any other Regular would do. You may think this isn't right as we don't go through 30 weeks, but I disagree, as a reserve we give up our free time to put ourselves through training, we give up our weekends and four weeks of holidays to earn our Beret. At the same time as trying to get fit enough to do our commando course we must also study (as I do) or work, most if not all our phys is done in our own time, as we only have limited time availible as it is for the more military aspects. Also, we aren't captivated, we don't constantly have PTIs making up circuits or beasting us around the bottom field. At the same time the reserves, in my view, isn't the place to go for an extra wage, there are far more second jobs out there that'll pay a hell of a better, for lot less effort.

Keep in mind though, being RMR, my views maybe slighty biased!

Cheers Calum

[Jimbo]

Reference the second part of your question, your argument that the "downsizing" of battles negates the need for reserve forces is extremly blinkered. The corps has an extremely wide range of responsibilities, and are currently short on numbers, and as result already overstretched. Enter into the equation another conflict to which 50% of the corps had to be deployed, I`m sure 600 commando trained reservists would be of considerable use.

[Leigh Dowell]

When 40Cdo deployed to Northern Iraq we took around 80 RMR with us to bring the unit upto strength work it out!

[Rogue Chef]

Over the years I have met a number of RMR lads who ended up becoming regulars through the 'triple S' system. Most notably when I was a troop Sgt in Alpha Coy during Op Haven, several RMR ranks were assigned to the company. Despite my initial reticence at having RMR lads on board at such short notice for an operational tour, my fears were unfounded. They hit the ground running, learned very quickly and the difference betwen regular and RMR was almost seamless. One of my RMR lads was Pete Curley, now a regular Cpl, ML2 and TV star!
Yours Aye
Steve

[Argonaught]

Cheers for your replys, mabey now ill stop giving my RMR mate a hard time for being a part timer!

[Dave220784]

ask any sgt who has had to go and work as a PSI at one of the RMR units what he thought about the reserves before compared to what they did after there 'sentancing' .

all rmr ranks are either ex regular Bootneck, or have completed the commando course (the same one the regulars do in the same time)

the reason people are 'RUBBER DAGGERS' is that they like civvy street and a chaalnge at weekend. the saying is:

'by land by sea
back home for sunday tea'

[Bootneck Officer]

I feel that I can contribute to this subject as someone who served in the RMR as an Officer for 4 years, before joining the Corps on completion of my degree.
The role of the RMR is to provide In Theatre Replacements to 3 Cdo Bde RM in time of all-out war, or times of over-stretch. Secondly, they are ear-marked to guard key installations as required. The '600 command-trained reservists' mentioned by Jimbo above is not considered a feasible option - notwithstanding the fact that about 4 RMR blokes ever turn up for an average soldiering weekend(A recruitment abseiling display in front of civilians is another matter), it has never been foreseen to use the RMR as a deployable unit.
Certain individuals may temporarily serve with the Corps on a Special Short Service (SSS) engagement. These guys are approved by their RMR unit prior to serving with a regular unit.
Some of these Reservists can - on recommendation - stay within the Corps on a longer term basis. For example there are several SCs and MLs who entered the Corps from the RMR, without carrying out 30 weeks of training. However these are the exception.
With regard to the training. I have done regular commando training, and the reservist course. Chalk and cheese.
There is a very severe difference between the continuous physical and mental pressure of being at Lympstone Commando for 30 (or 54) Weeks of training, with a commando course at the end; or turning up for a 12 day course( the other point being that RMR attempt the course as many times as they like).
I had the privilege of commanding a Recruit Troop at CTCRM several years ago. The difference in mental and physical standards between their training and mine as an RMR Recruit 12 years ago are immense - and I won the Commando Medal as an RMR nod.
When I was enduring YO Training, myself and another ex-Rubber compared our RMR experiences to what we were going through as regulars. We were both agreed that the regular training was an utterly different and much more severe test. We were only in Week 3 at the time.
By the end of our 6-week commando course, we considered our Green Berets very different from the ones we wore as Rubber Daggers.
I still consider my beret as being indicative of having passed the most professional and physically exacting basic military course in the world.
By comparison, the reservists course is taxing, but not on anywhere near the same level or standard.
I know - I have done both.
So if you want to join the Corps, join the real, professional Corps. You will notice there are quite a lot of RMR comments above. Why is this?
This is because the bulk of the Brigade are around the world at present, conducting operations, or on exercise. That is, doing the job. If you want to join them, join the professionals.

[Barrybolox]

I can also contribute to this debate as someone who served for 4 years in the RMR as a marine while studying for my degree prior to joining the regular corps. Firstly, the role of the RMR is no longer as stated above, but is to provide support to the regular corps as need be, normally through providing individuals rather than as a complete deployable unit.

On the subject of recruit training it would not be fair to compare the two in terms of intensity etc. because they are not designed to be the same, what is important is that the end result is the same in terms of quality of men. The standards needed to be achieved are exactly the same, RMR nods cannot attempt the commando course as many times as they like. RMR training has changed entirely throughout the last 10 years to bring it more in line with the regular corps, hence the large amount of RMR lads currently serving within 3cdo brigade at present. Indeed, it would be fair to say that the majority of daggers I have seen in the regular corps are head and shoulders above most of the marines currently passing out of regular training. The majority that is, not all.

I can assure you that the bulk of the brigade are currently around the globe on exercise or operation, dripping endlessly about the inadequacies of the corps hierarchy whos' administration skills bring to mind the words 'piss up and brewry'. If you want to be a day to day bootneck then join the regular corps, if your personal circumstances do not permit it, then join the RMR.

[Bootneck Officer]

In reply to the above, there are a few issues.
First, the standards of an RMR course are nowhere near that of regular training. Do you, or have you worked at CTCRM? If you disagree, that is your right. My experience tells me different.
Second, RMR nods do attempt the course as often as they like. That not be official policy, but that is the practice - I personally know at least 7 RMR blokes who tried the 2-week Commando Course at least 3 times.
Third, the point about RMR blokes being 'head and shoulders' above Marines leaving CTCRM at present is claptrap. I have served as a Troop Commander and Company 2ic within a Commando Unit in the past 9 years, as well as 2 Detachment Commander jobs, a Company Command, and recently as an Adjutant. I have served with RMR throughout all that experience. I have never encountered any Reservists who are head and shoulders above recently qualified Marines, with the exception of 1 bloke - Steff Moran, who is a very good oppo of mine. Otherwise, I utterly disagree with this comment.
Finally I am glad that you 'can assure us' that the lads will be dripping all around the globe, mainly as a result of the inefficiencies of the Corps' administration and senior Officers. You are probably right. There is nothing novel about that point. The lads have always dripped, and always will - a bootneck's prerogative. However, they are always ready to move to do the job.
That is my point. If someone wants to join the Corps, and be a professional Marine, it stands to reason that he should partake in professional Marine training. If - as you say - circumstances do not allow, the RMR is an excellent option.
If you have not enjoyed your time in the regular Corps, and think that your RMR colleagues were a mega bunch of lads, then that is your experience. It is contrary to mine. I would like to know which units you have recently served in where the lads are so poor coming out of training.
Your point about the RMR's present role - as supporting the Corps in time of need is the same as that I made in the previous message.

[scott]

Having spent 4 years in the regular corps I found the training both physically and emotionally exhausting. 30 weeks of training followed by years of additional training and SQ/TQ etc. ensure that that the corps has some of the worlds best soldiers. I could not have done too bad I got the KB. However, since then I have spent 10 years in the RMR helping regular PSI's train the recruits. Being at CTCRM for 30 weeks was hard enough but I do not think I would like to go through nearly 2 years of RMR training. Having a civvy job all week then having to 'change hats' and go live in the field all weekend and then go back to my civvy job again would be very demanding. I know want your going to say..boo hoo if you can't hack it then leave. Well, just like the regs many do, leaving only the most determind to carry on. At least at CTC you are emersed in the corps surrounded by your mates. There are many RMR lads that are equally good marines as those in the regs, some even better. The Bootneck officer who claims that he has never encountered a better RMR trained marine (other than his mate) could not have met many. As far as RMR marines not being professional because they have not done the 30 weeks at CTC, well what chance have they if some reg officers think like this?
Yours
Scott

[Bootneck Officer]

Listen, before this starts to lose the point, I am not anti-RMR. Nor have I said anything that indicates the RMR are less than professional.
If we refer to the original question, from a prospective recruit, about the RMR,and whether their training is exactly the same as in the Corps. I state that it is not exactly the same as in the Corps, and that it does not produce the same average standard of commando soldier as 30 weeks of Lympstone does. My point is that any prospective recruits should join the Corps unless their personal circumstances limit that opportunity.
At no stage have I slated the RMR - as originally stated, I was a Rubber for 4 years - and had a great time within it.
With regard to your comment that you think I have had limited exposure to RMR personnel of late, I have written with a lot of experience of both RMR and regular Marines in a full-time professional soldiering environment over the past 10 years. I am content that my comments hold validity.
You say that you assist in the training of RMR recruits. You are evidently passionate about that. At the same time, there are many JNCOs and SNCOs at CTC who are enthusiastic and passionate about what they produce. In my most recent years, I have had a number of RMR lads working with me who have been, however none who stood out as being way above the average.
It seems that the status of the RMR is a sensitive issue, and all involved are keen to defend the RMR when it is not even under any criticism. If you actually believe the RMR are producing the same quality of soldiers as regular training does, then you should take this up with Geoff Hoon, the First Sea Lord, and the CG, and offer them a way of saving about 80 Million per annum.
Again, if you disagree, that is your opinion, based on your own experiences. I have mine, based on my recent and ongoing experiences.
It is a great sacrifice that RMR guys make in their private and professional lives to undertake reservist training, and I have a great deal of respect for that; however I have a greater respect for a 16/17 year old who passes through 30 weeks of demanding training - with all the personal sacrifices that that requires - and then goes on to perfect his skills in a commando.
This is not anti-RMR. This is not anti-RMR. This is not anti-RMR. This is not anti-RMR.

[ratso]

I think we are all missing something about the RMR, which is the problems they have in getting people like you and me who have the coverted green to help provide what they need a trained experienced force which can be utilised when needed.
This should form the main core of the RMR but they find it not so. I have every respect for anyone these days who even gets out of bed on a saturday to yomp over moors when he or she does not have to. So lets stop pulling them appart and applaud them for the time they give even if they don't give it all.
I wish I had done it but now I'm past it, back to training cadets next still good fun though.......

[Jimbo]

Just a small point to bear in mind,

From an initial intake of 68, I was the only bloke to pass out.

The RMR is not an easy option, if you want to serve with the corps and have the option go regular, if you doubt the dedication and determination
of RMR personel consider the above, such small numbers are not rare.