Want A quite Life, Join The Guards

[Tab]

Fighting falls to a minority of regiments
By Thomas Harding, Defence Correspondent
(Filed: 08/05/2006)



A minority of regiments is conducting the majority of military operations, according to figure obtained by The Daily Telegraph, exposing serious flaws in Army operational planning.

Almost half of the 40 infantry battalions and most light cavalry regiments have taken on the burden of tours to Iraq, Afghanistan and the Balkans, while others have hardly been abroad.

In particular, the five Guards regiments, which perform ceremonial duties at Buckingham Palace, have barely fought abroad in the past five years, while other regiments have been in near constant action.

The figures also show that the Ministry of Defence has severely breached its guidelines on giving battalions enough rest between operations.

Military chiefs are worried that, as some infantry regiments go into conflict zones at least once a year, experienced troops are not spending enough time with their families and that some are leaving the Army as a result.

The Tories have accused the ministry of "fudging" its figures and misleading the public into believing that there has been enough rest between operations.

On average, infantry troops have been on operations every 15 months and some units have had only four months rest between expeditions, all in breach of the military's "harmony guideline" of 24 months.

The SAS, logistics regiments, Royal Engineers and medics have all been on almost continuous operations since the September 11 terrorist attacks, leading to worries of burn-out.

By contrast, the Coldstream Guards have made one tour of Iraq. The Grenadiers made a short tour of Northern Ireland, followed by three years off then a four-month tour of Bosnia early last year - although some are deploying to Iraq this month.

Liam Fox, the shadow defence minister, said the figures revealed "the alarming pressures" being put on front-line troops and criticised the Government for breaking the guidelines.

"With some units spending barely a few months out of theatre, the strain upon them and their families must be having a detrimental effect," Dr Fox said.

"It is vital that they have a proper amount of time to rest, re-train and see their families before embarking on further operations. This is further evidence of overstretch in the Armed Forces."

A senior Whitehall official admitted that the "point was recognised" that the "spread of the burden" fell on some regiments and said the matter would be addressed under the Future Infantry Structure programme.

But the Tories have described the figures as "dire" for some units. For example, the Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders, now 5 Bn the Royal Regiment of Scotland, served in Northern Ireland until late 2003, had a four-month rest then went to Iraq for six months in 2004.

Eight months later they were in Bosnia for a six-month tour. They are now on standby to deploy to Northern Ireland if an emergency occurs or could be dispatched to Afghanistan late in the summer.

The Royal Regiment of Wales has barely paused for breath, serving on seven deployments in as many years.

For some cavalry units the figures are worse, including the Household Cavalry, which Prince Harry will join this year as a troop commander. Elements of the Armoured Reconnaissance Regiment have had a total of only six months off between serving in Bosnia in October 2001 and Iraq at the end of 2004.

Last month's annual Army Continuous Attitude Survey, which questions troops about their views of the military, found that two thirds of soldiers were dissatisfied with the large amount of time they were having to spend away from home.

"Certainly quite a few battalions are doing more of the workload than others and we are nowhere near the harmony guidelines," a senior officer said yesterday.

"We are getting to the point now where, if another medium-scale deployment - say to Darfur, in Sudan - was needed, it is highly unlikely that we could fulfil it."

The Ministry of Defence admitted that it had broken its own rules. But it said it hoped that, with the "draw-down" of troops in Northern Ireland over the next year, possibly followed by a recall of some soldiers from Iraq and the Balkans, the pressure would be eased.

A spokesman said: "The current scale of deployments is judged by the Chiefs of Staff to be manageable and the Armed Forces remain ready to take on any future operations that may arise."


30 April 2006: British troops in Iraq are afraid to open fire, secret MoD report confirms
23 April 2006: Officers blame minister's interference for throwing Afghan mission into confusion
4 May 2006: Night on guard with the neighbourhood watch of Baghdad



The Regiment that has seen the most deployments is 2 Para

[Hantslad]

This is a good article, but ANYONE who is actually in the Armed Forces, could have told the press this! Certainly ANYONE in one of the over used, over stretched units!

[Grimey Vibes]

Because we have been doing a public duties role for the past 5 years. We are now on ops duty, in Iraq and going to Afgan to do war fighting next march, we got about 5 months after finishing this tour till the next, bear in mind we have training to do as well. Plus don't join the Grenadier Guards, there freckin anal, most of the officers and senior sgt's are up there own arses, i am only here till after afgan tour, after which i am going in the guards para platoon and banging in my full transfer when i get there. Don't know any other reg that comes any where near this.

[Tab]

Grimy .....Can't the TA do the public duties rather than the fighting as the Guards claim to great soldiers...Notice I only said claim.

[Grimey Vibes]

LOL, nice dig . Nope, there are no TA units for guards as the job we do is special, special needs in my opinion. The cermonial side of things, has to be done 24/7 at 4 different places. We don't like doing it but it has to be done, so there are always 2 Foot Guards Regiment based on cermonial, while 3 of us have public duties companys which also carry out the roles. As i say when my regiment go back to public duties in 3 years, i wont be joining them, transfer would of been in by then.

[m-a-s-s-e-y]

Mate sympathise with you, we had NO 1 company Coldstream guards attached to us in Al amarah at the end of the tour had four days in Basrah Apod as de stress time or whatever its called, We never started before nine oclock, spent the day playing football down the gym,sunbathing etc the coldstreamers did two hours of drill every morning and generally got f@#k about no need for it. Has everyone signed off in your battalion? If everyone whose signed off in ours gets out this time next year we'll have to cut another rifle company as we simply won't have the man power to fill it.

[Grimey Vibes]

Well i think as it stands, around 10-15 people per company have signed off or put a transfer in, and we are only just under 4 weeks into this tour says it all. I don't think it will be long before there are cuts to the Household Division. You think the Coldstreamers got messed around?? Try being in the Grens, its 2 times worse than any of the other foot guards, and they will all say that. I don't like it all that much

[owdun]

Garrison soldiering is a bassard, all bull and drill, tough disciplines. You join the Guards and thats what you get during peace-time.

As to T.A.units, they were never intended to replace the Regular Army on active service, unless the country was in a declared war against such a country as Germany. It suits the Govt. to blur the situation. It has run down our Forces to such a low level,that it cannot continue to look the big, in the international arena, without our reserve forces.

Owdun.

[Grimey Vibes]

Garrison soldiering is a bassard, all bull and drill, tough disciplines. You join the Guards and thats what you get during peace-time.

As to T.A.units, they were never intended to replace the Regular Army on active service, unless the country was in a declared war against such a country as Germany. It suits the Govt. to blur the situation. It has run down our Forces to such a low level,that it cannot continue to look the big, in the international arena, without our reserve forces.

Owdun.

All drill and bull is garrision soldering?? Its all over this op tour, we have even done the drill bit. We now have 2 dead from our BG and the Sgt Major was moaning about people not wearing a floppy hat outside of camp,
If our patrols ever gets contacted (Gren patrol) i can imagine him, "where there shirts correctly ironed?? That might be why then"
Yes he even tried to get each tent a iron and board to iron combats, OMG its so anal its quite funny thinking about it

[HCR]

There's always method behind the madness Grimey.

What seems like total bull s@it and a f*ck around factor to the Junior ranks is actually nescersary to the seniors.

Making you iron your shirts, doing abit of drill while on operations is probably being seen as keeping you young lads from betting bored and keeping your heads on your shoulders, making life as normal as possible. We all know how boring tours can get when you cant go out you watched every bit of Porn available and there's no Women. And when Soldiers get bored we know what happens especially you youngones

But you are in the Guards and there different from all the Chippie Regiments arnt they Grimey. Guards depot drill that into from day one.

Well mate if you want to go on lots of tours Im off to Helmand, Afganistan this year then Iraq AGAIN next year, Still be Blue Red Blue without the b*llshit get treated like an adult do your P Coy as I know you really want to do, Be on a higher pay scale and when you tell the Yanks your Recce they think your SF and you dont even have to do ceremonial because I only did 18 months in my 11 years and alot of lads have never done it. Then join the Household Cavalry it will be easy as your staying in the Household Division

Go on I will get the ball rolling this end for you

[Grimey Vibes]

Cheers HCR, given me a little morale. I think its just me getting first tours blue's or something. I am just being a purging lil idiot, sorry for whining everyone. Will see how things are after this tour and decide on what i am going to do with my future. I had 2 days leave before i came out here, i think thats the main factor behind it (Op tour is only 4 months so no RnR). Once i have had leave, christmas leave will be like a month and a hlaf away. Afganistan will be only a few months away after that so will be looking forward to that. I woke up happy today and just thought i might as well make the best of it, since i am here to stay :p

[K9dug]

Was out in Iraq with 1WG, and was shocked daily on how bad there "G-men" were, really bad soldiers.

as for their L/sgts , they need to ctach a grip, THEY ARE ONLY FULL SCREWS!!

[Grimey Vibes]

Was out in Iraq with 1WG, and was shocked daily on how bad there "G-men" were, really bad soldiers.

as for their L/sgts , they need to ctach a grip, THEY ARE ONLY FULL SCREWS!!

Welcome to the guards, once you get past G-man then people just seem to develop some bad attitudes, there are a minority who are sound. I can't comment on the WG as i have never worked with them.

[K9dug]

Welcome to the guards, once you get past G-man then people just seem to develop some bad attitudes, there are a minority who are sound. I can't comment on the WG as i have never worked with them.[/quote]

Really poor soldiers mate, worse thing was they thought they were some sort of elite unit, lovely drill but ugly patrolling.

The ironic thing is the most unorganised part of the tour was the actual camp guard!, 4 days of 6 on 6 off at one stage i was bleeding out of my nut!!!

I can only think of 2 L/sgts who thought of themselves as section com. rather than plt. sgts.

add to that a RSM (yes RSM not THE Sgt.Maj!!) who drove around camp in a JCB and you've got a Bn. in trouble!

[Dogwatch]

Times have changed then, patrolled with the Coldstream Guards and the Scots Guards in Derry in the 70's, very switched on and always felt comfortable with them although I was from a a different service.