The "Doors"

[FIRE]

I was wondering why the American Humvee's (and also Spanish or Italian vehicle's) in Iraq have often no doors. I mean the men in the vehicle would be more protected against bullets or even rpg's if it had doors.

Has somebody the answer?

[Rockape]

They've probably removed the doors thinking that they'll be able to de-bus quickly in a contact. True, however current thinking suggests you try and drive through the contact, rather than de-bus into it, which is worst case scenario. In that type of contact, vehicles become massive bullet magnets. Only steel doors would give some added protection. Windows, unless armoured, become a hazard when rounds or shrapnel hit them.

It seems a case of 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. It's getting that fine balance between protection and being able to manouvre.

[anglo-saxon]

I mean the men in the vehicle would be more protected against bullets or even rpg's if it had doors.

Uh, not! Regular doors wouldn't stop a low velocity round like .22, let alone high velocity. I've seen an APC (M113) hit by an RPG at the rear left corner, with fragments exiting through the forward right corner. That's after going through the crew compartment and through the radio assembly. Put anything you want on a light vehicle like a Humvee, it won't stop an RPG.

So, given that doors can be extremely restrictive in movement, weapon use, and deployment, it is probably wise not to have them. These guys have, after all, learned as they go and it obviously works for them.

[USARMY_]

Fire, you ever ridden in a HUMVEE before? The doors are either made of light weight metal or plastic sheeting. All they do is restrict movement in and out of the vehicle. Plus with the doors removed more air flow gets in and the soldiers have more space to sit. The size of the vehicle is misleading when you think about space to sit, its very cramp. Think of being in a box a TV came in closed wearing BDU's, web gear, gun belt, your pro mask and nbc suit, butt pack, ammo, your weapon, kevlar...oh and it's 150 degrees inside that box.

[Jagd]

Wasn't there a plan recently to upgrade the Humvee armour to withstand rifle ammunition? Or was that not including the doors?

[goreD.]

The U.K. have been practising similar tacitics for years. The Northern Ireland snatch vehicles used there where specifically designed for use in counter insurgency operations.

They have adequate armour protection against small arms fire. There main protection against RPG's, however is there offensive capability.

[Guest]

Did anyone else see a vehicle the Yanks had in Iraq with makeshift armour welded on? Think it was a Humvee not sure...