Rank during pilot training

[HighlandSniper58]

Hyperlithe

I can very much see your point, however what annoyed me at the time I went through IOT (and still does) is that many graduates whose degrees had no relevance whatsoever to the branch of service they were entering were treated so differently to the direct entry officer cadets.

OK, I appreciate the specialist nature of your degree, but you have to admit that other than perhaps catering or admin/sec specialization even this bears little relevance to any operational job, unlike say an engineering or aeronautics degree.

N.B. I am totally ruling out specialist degrees such as medicine, dentistry, law, theology etc., which are outside the normal IOT system - these fall into a different category altogether.

My objection is that I went to Cranwell aged 23 - with a wide and varied experience of life - I challenge far more than any graduate - and was paid much, much less than any graduate.

My view is that unless an entrant to IOT has a degree which gives him/her a specialist advance in their given career, all should enter under the same conditions. OK, Engineer with an engineering degree, caterer with a catering/similar degree, but otherwise all on level pegging.

I would be interested to hear which branch you are entering, and whether your degree has any direct relevance to your planned career in the RAF.

[Hyperlithe]

I did say I'm sure, but my degree is not relevant to my new career, I'm going in as a linguist. So I've chosen not to go down the officer route, which I was also approved for, but will instead be a SNCO.
I could have been a catering officer, but I actually can't imagine anything worse! I'm joining the RAF because I want to get out of the Hospitality industry and go back to what I'm really good at, which is languages.
The entrance qualifications state 1 GCSE in a modern foreign language, at gradeC or above. I've got 3, all at A or above, and an A level, for which I also got an A, but it will make no difference whatsoever either though training or after. I will have to rely on my ability.

Perhaps cadets' education and employment history should be sealed? That way noone can be treated any differently, except on their actions during training?

[HighlandSniper58]

Hyperlithe

You've totally got me now! Is this a direct entry SNCO programme? I wasn't aware such things existed outside NCO aircrew, but there again it's a long time since I fully explored the full spectrum of entry types.

Since writing my last post on this thread, I remembered one of the guys on my IOT entry - he was GD (Pilot) and had a degree in Estate (i.e. land) management - what relevance was that to any aircrew job?

I would be interested to hear more of your plans since the job/branch structure has changed so much since my day.

[Hyperlithe]

Maybe I should have been more specific - WSOp(L), it is an aircrew position!

[HighlandSniper58]

Got you now.

So it's Nimrod R.1, Sentry or Sentinel for you then.

[Hyperlithe]

Nimrod R1 only!
If they can get more than one operational sometime soon....

[steve_nels4]

im going to uni next month and then hopefully join the RAF. I can see where your views are coming from, but from what i can tell, the reasons for maybe them bein treated differently is that the majority of them have completed their elementary flying training at their air university where they have obviously had a lot of connectiong within the RAF and experience with certain aspects of it. Im not sure about how much there is a difference in pay scales between graduates and direct entrants, but direct entrants are earning in the three years that the uni students are at uni (if thats makes sense) so it sort of makes up for it in the long run ? or have i misread something? just a suggestion.

[HighlandSniper58]

im going to uni next month and then hopefully join the RAF. I can see where your views are coming from, but from what i can tell, the reasons for maybe them bein treated differently is that the majority of them have completed their elementary flying training at their air university where they have obviously had a lot of connectiong within the RAF and experience with certain aspects of it. Im not sure about how much there is a difference in pay scales between graduates and direct entrants, but direct entrants are earning in the three years that the uni students are at uni (if thats makes sense) so it sort of makes up for it in the long run ? or have i misread something? just a suggestion.

I can see where you're coming from here, but it is not the case. The term "Student Officer" is applied to any graduate on entry to Cranwell, whilst "Officer Cadets" are either direct from the outside (University of Life) or former serving airmen - or at least that was the case when I went through IOT. This applies to all branches and irrespective of whether the "Student Officer" was on a University Cadetship/Bursary.

[rawli]

That is still the case Hyper.

[2nd time round]

Hi Guys,

Interesting points made previously, just thought I'd throw something new into the mix. Serving airmen who gain a place on IOT can be commissioned as Flt Lts if they have gained thier degree. Their previous military service entitles them to this rapid promotion due to thier ability to integrate their new status more quickly than non military persons.

As explained above, graduates become commissioned as Flying Officers and non-graduates acting pilot Officers. Promotion to Flt Lt can be done after a first tour depending upon previous 'life' experience.

Hyper mate, you passed OASC, you have the qualities and most importantly YOU ARE IN ! who cares what your degree's in, YOU GOT ONE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. By the way keep us posted on how you are doing, I did basic training at RAF Swinderby a long, long time ago before DYP'ing and would be interested as to how things may have changed. Do they still do bed packs ?.

[Hyperlithe]

9 shifts left to work!
Basic training is at RAF Halton, as far as I know, yup, they still do bedpacks. Was gonna get my brother to show me but he's beggared off to Italy for a year to play with the foreigners.

[Slider]

My objection is that I went to Cranwell aged 23 - with a wide and varied experience of life - I challenge far more than any graduate - and was paid much, much less than any graduate.

My view is that unless an entrant to IOT has a degree which gives him/her a specialist advance in their given career, all should enter under the same conditions. OK, Engineer with an engineering degree, caterer with a catering/similar degree, but otherwise all on level pegging.

The RAF kindly told me that my degree proved I had a trainable mind and at least a set level of intelligence. As they were about to spend a fair bit of cash sending me through 4-5 years' of flying training, they liked my degree as it proved I could stick to a scheme of training that lasted that long, and could reproduce it at the end.

As I had taken the time to prove this to them, they thought I deserved a bit more cash. They could have taken me at 18, but who knows what I would have done at 20?

[Tab]

The first rank in the RAF is Pilot Officer, so why do you expect to start above that.