Would you want a sidearm all times in combat?

Sully · Post by **Sully** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 11:21 am

I managed to hit 65 out of 60

in my basic training APWT LSW shoot, largely thanks to 'Tetley' in the lane next to me having number recognition problems. After that I couldn't hit an elephants arse with a banjo - 'supressing fire' I think its called

Archie · Post by **Archie** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 12:00 pm

I had an SMG as my sidearm whilst lugging my old Scandinavian pal Charlie G around, does that count?

Re the idea of having a pistol as a backup in case of stoppage, shouldn't we have weapons that do not routinely fail? Come to that which is quicker, doing the IA and sorting your stoppage or fumbling a pistol out of the holster, load, cock it, wait till you can see the whites of their eyes, then miss with damn thing?

Oh yes, and if you had counted your rounds as you fired, you would be less likely to be suprised by the no rounds in the magazine and none in the chamber scenario.

But of course if you had a weapon with a good range and some stopping power e.g. a 7.62 self loading type weapon, the problem should be considerably lessened.

I feel an SA80 versus just about anything on the market discussion coming on.

gash-hand · Post by **gash-hand** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 12:08 pm

when i did my jumps course there were a few old and bold para's knocking around, apparently they routinely jump with a pistol as this is easier to manouver whilst decending from the heavens.

anyone know if this has any truth in it?

Archie · Post by **Archie** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 12:19 pm

That has a whiff of best Para bullshit to me. How much time do you have between checking your chute, dangling your container and then hitting the deck?

For those who don't know, it's about 3 to four seconds on a training jump at 800 feet. On an operational jump you may well be at just 400 feet and have no time whatsoever.

gash-hand · Post by **gash-hand** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 12:30 pm

well thats what i thought but you never know.

i could never work out how long it took to descend as by the time i realised that :

A. the chute was open

B. i'd just jumped out of a perfectly serviceable aircraft

c. and avoided everyone else in the sky thinking the same thing

d. and made sure it was the container i was releasing!!!

I was just about ready to cream in big style

Archie · Post by **Archie** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 12:38 pm

Exactly so GH.

So come on, is there a Para out there who can remember back far enough to when they last did an operational jump? Eee by gum it were a reet long while since tha knows.

Archie stop winding up Paras you bad lad!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sorry, but I can't help it, it's part of my core (or should that be Corps) programming.

voodoo sprout · Post by **voodoo sprout** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 1:48 pm

I've just found this little gem, a report on equipment used in Iraq by the USMC. And on page six is mentions that a lot of US marines were asking for a backup weapons issued as standard, though it has to be said it seems they want these as the M16 series is too big for some situations, a problem not so significant with the SA80.

http://www.sftt.org/PDF/article05122003a.pdf

1812USMarine · Post by **1812USMarine** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 4:20 pm

I always carried a sidearm during land ops, even when humping an M-60 MG. Not one of these silly little 9mm y'all have now, the M1911A .45, a man's weapon designed to immobilize drug-crazed Huks instantly near 100 years ago. Interestingly, the first time I ever had to "deploy" this particular nasty in anger wasn't in the bush, but rather onboard a docked ship against one of the very people it was designed for. Damn near knocked my teeth out as I was a dumb 17 year old trying to shoot like John Wayne.

stinkypinky · Post by **stinkypinky** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 4:56 pm

being in both combat situations and peacekeeping,all patrol/section commanders should have a 9mm ,then again the british army has not nearly enough to go around.my unit has around 40 total for a 400 regt,and yes you guessed it they all go to the rodneys who do f**k all but annoy you with stupid requests and orders while they sit drinking pimms and writing your cr.(tossers)

DelD · Post by **DelD** » Thu 05 Jun, 2003 11:38 pm

Voodoo Sprout, who was your earlier post aimed at?

Andy O'Pray · Post by **Andy O'Pray** » Fri 06 Jun, 2003 12:07 am

Stinkpinky. Perhaps you can educate me. what artillery batteries have 8 guns? Any of the batteries I have worked with had 6 guns, but I could be out of date.

Aye - andy.

stinkypinky · Post by **stinkypinky** » Fri 06 Jun, 2003 12:36 am

andy,you are indeed out of date in wartime a bty has 8 gns,because of this and the new rates of fire a AS90 can acheive it is now Fire Mission No of guns instead of Fire Mission Battery,hope this helps ,but this is only for AS90 regt ,cannot speak for light gun regt's,or launchers(MLRS).In your defense andy in peacetime a bty does have 6 guns but again fire is judjed on No of guns now instead of No of btys.

Andy O'Pray · Post by **Andy O'Pray** » Fri 06 Jun, 2003 12:47 am

Thanks for that Stinkypinky. My experiences have been with the Commando 105 batteries and they always had six guns. I myself was with the unit mortar troops, therefore worked closley with the battery.

Aye - Andy.

stinkypinky · Post by **stinkypinky** » Fri 06 Jun, 2003 1:04 am

no probs andy ,always good to hear from a fellow long range sniper(sort of with mortars).keep up the good work!!!
P.s BATUS is shit!! but lethbridge is class!

BenChug · Post by **BenChug** » Fri 06 Jun, 2003 2:18 am

Stinkypinky you going to lethbridge in the near future?

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Would you want a sidearm all times in combat?