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Britons facing visa restrictions to the USA

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Wholley
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Post by Wholley »

Spannerman wrote:But Wholley this is the Americans aircraft carrier in the Atlantic!
I don't think anyone here thinks that way about the UK.
At least not out side of the Pentagon.
Like I said I'm thankful no-one got injured.
Thats my personal opinion of course.
Wholley.
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Spannerman
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Post by Spannerman »

This will probably set the cat among the pigeons..........errrmmm do you think that the USA are solely here in the UK to defend Britain, do you think that the USA is in S Korea to protect the S Koreans or do you think they are based in Turkey to protect the Turks or really in Iraq to free the Iraqis? NOPE THEY ARE IN THOSE PLACES TO PROTECT THEIR OWN INTERESTS
Frank S.
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Post by Frank S. »

And for a more in-depth look into the means to protect those interests, see:
http://www.iwar.org.uk/psyops/

And:
http://www.techweb.com/wire/story/TWB19990706S0015

And:
http://www.cyber-rights.org/foia/
Frank S.
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Post by Frank S. »

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=s ... ing_allies

U.S. to Fingerprint More Foreigners

By SUZANNE GAMBOA, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - A program requiring foreigners to be fingerprinted and photographed before entering the country is being expanded to include millions of travelers from some of America's closest allies, U.S. officials said Friday.

The move affects citizens in 27 countries — including Britain, Japan and Australia — who had been allowed to travel within the United States without a visa for up to 90 days, according to the Homeland Security Department.


Under changes in the US-VISIT program that will take effect by Sept. 30, they will be fingerprinted and photographed when they enter through any of 115 international airports and 14 seaports. There are no changes in unique rules covering visits by Canadians and Mexicans.


The Bush administration made the move after determining most of the so-called "visa-waiver countries" won't meet an October deadline to have biometric passports, said Asa Hutchinson, undersecretary for border and transportation security. Such passports include fingerprint and iris identification features that make the documents virtually impossible to counterfeit.


Citizens from those countries still won't have to go through the consulate interviews, background checks, fingerprinting and photographing that people from other nations must do to obtain a visa.


The US-VISIT program was passed by Congress in response to the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks. In January, the U.S. government began fingerprinting and photographing visitors from nations other than the visa-waiver countries.


About 5 million people have been processed so far and more than 200 with prior or suspected criminal or immigration violations have been stopped, according to Homeland Security.


Hutchinson said adding the estimated 13 million annual visitors from visa-waiver countries should not create massive backlogs at airports and seaports. He said it takes only 23 seconds per person to take fingerprints and photos and check them against government files.


However, fingerprinting the visa-waiver citizens could have ramifications for Americans when they travel abroad. When US-VISIT began last winter, Brazil retaliated by requiring Americans visiting that country to be fingerprinted and photographed.


Hutchinson said he does not expect other countries will follow Brazil's example. He and other U.S. officials have been talking to their counterparts in the visa-waiver countries and told them their nations could be added to US-VISIT. None expressed strong reservations, he said.


"Our allies, they will see this as a good security measure," he said.


The visa-waiver countries are: Andorra, Australia, Austria, Belgium, Brunei, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Iceland, Ireland, Italy, Japan, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Monaco, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Portugal, San Marino, Singapore, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland and the United Kingdom.


___


On the Net:


Homeland Security: http://www.dhs.gov


What of the French and Germans?!? :o
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Post by Marina »

Hi Frank,

I am a bit confused about the whole visa issue. :-? :oops:

I am going to Washington DC end of october to attend ICCAC conference (Interscience conference on Antimicrobial Agents).

1) Does this mean that I don't need have to have an interview and get a visa, as I will be assessed at the airport ?

2) I renewed my passport in 2002 - Is it better to change my passport to biometric ?
Frank S.
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Post by Frank S. »

I wish I knew. :-?

Did you read about Ian Mc Ewan's trouble getting into the US from Canada?
US immigration laws were always screwy but they're becoming exquisitely complicated with those new measures.

I don't understand it.
Here's a link to DHS about the US-VISIT program, I hope it'll provide answers, but in this climate I also expect procedures to change between now and October.
http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/interapp/e ... l_0333.xml
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Post by Marina »

Thanks for the info Frank

You are a star ! :D

P.S
I didn't know about Ian McEwan having trouble entering th US ?

Also, why are Mexican nationals allowed no visa restrictions ?
Aren't they always crossing the border illegally anyway ?
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Post by Frank S. »

Here's the article about Mc Ewan:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=s ... yfirstlady

(My, that's one hell of a URL)

Excerpt:
Homeland Security officials barred famous British author Ian McEwan, a favorite of First Lady Laura Bush, from entering the United States from Canada for 36 hours this week because of a mix-up over his visitor's visa.

McEwan endured a day of questioning at the Vancouver airport, a night in a hotel and hours of waiting at a U.S. Consulate before officials allowed him to fly to Seattle on Wednesday evening--barely in time for a long-planned lecture to 2,500 people.


At the lecture, he congratulated the Department of Homeland Security for "protecting the American public--from British novelists."


McEwan, 55, whose book "Atonement" won the 2002 National Book Critics Circle Award, said in a telephone interview Thursday that Homeland Security officials questioned him "at great length" about his intentions. "I was caught in the middle trying to be as polite as I could to everybody, and trying not to feel like a criminal," he said.


British consular officials in Canada and local members of Congress lobbied the government on McEwan's behalf. Philanthropic groups in Seattle and Portland, Ore., where he had been booked to lecture this week, scrambled to find an immigration lawyer to help him.


The confusion Tuesday and Wednesday apparently generated a bureaucratic dust-up between the Homeland Security Department and the State Department, which McEwan said wanted to admit him to the U.S.


It appears that McEwan was caught in a gray area of immigration policy. He planned, as usual, to enter the U.S. with a "visa waiver," which allows citizens from 27 U.S. allies, including Britain and other Western European nations, to stay for up to three months for "tourism or business," according to the State Department's Web site.

[end excerpt]

As to Mexicans, we have a 'special relationship' with Mexico, a rather strange one. We also have less restrictions for Canadian citizens as I understand it.
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Re: Britons facing visa restrictions to the USA

Post by Lucent »

This is taking the piss, that means effectively the cost of airfare goes from around 2-300 to amost 3-400. Not fun for younger travellers at all, and how on earth do people not near a US embassy apply for a Visa ?
Apart from everyone else that'll really mess up students heading over on J-1 visas for the summer. And despite all this theres still umpteen gizillion mexicans jumping the border everyday. They should be doing better intelligence, and using profiling like El Al.

T
Marina wrote:
1 - A British citizen has to apply in person at the US embassy.
2 - A British citizen has to pay £67 for a visa ? even for the briefest of visits.
5 - Visa restrictions on travel to USA will affect anyone with new British passports issued after 26th October, 2004.
"He who will not reason is a bigot; he who cannot is a fool;
and he who dares not, is a slave." ---William Drummond.
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Tab
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Post by Tab »

I can understand America's point of view, have you asked your self were the shoe bomber came from, what about the two lads from this country who became suicide bombers in Isreal, what about the group that have just been sent to prison in Egypt for trying to stir up a banned Muslim funamentalist group, and what did the Americans find out from those young innocent lads that they caught in Afghanistan, what about the Clerics in London that are screaming hate at the America, and you wonder why they are not to keen to let us in with out some form of checks.

:drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking: :drinking:
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Post by Frank S. »

I understand the measure in principle, but I see it as incomplete and flawed.
First, fingerprinting technology can misidentify a given subject, or not identify the subject at all, due to things like dry or cracked skin as well as the shallowness of the ridges. There are easy ways to achieve this to fool the system, and it has been done.
In the case of airport security, it'd be necessary, one assumes, to compare a passenger's fingerprint with a database of terror suspects. This assumes in turn that a 'known' terror suspect would be foolish enough to attempt entry in that manner (possible but unlikely) and second, that the 'matching' process between entry point and database would be fast enough so as not to 'inconvenience' passengers to an unmanageable point.

Facial recognition systems may be more accurate but similar comparison issues exist, along with a myriad other problems.

In the end I think it's more of a hopeful deterrent rather than any sort of active security measure.
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Post by Wholley »

Marina.
This looks a lot like the old B-1 Tourist visa except it's even more confusing.I would contact the US Embassy in London to clarify well ahead of your planned trip(DC in October?Take your long underwear).Don't attempt to call them though,you just get in an endless loop unless you have an ext.#Here's their web address.
http://www.usembassy.org.uk/
Once there have a look in the visa or Ambasador link.
That should give you access to a real person that could maybe help you through this tangled web.
Wholley.
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Marina
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Post by Marina »

Thanks Wholley for the useful info

You are a star ! :D

I don't think I will call because all I will end up hearing is is press blah blah for so and so which take ages and by the time you reach the person who is supposed to help you, you find out he/she is off that day !!
I suppose I'll be spending all day down Grosvenor Square like in the old days !! :(

P.S
What do you mean by long underwear ?
Is it freezing in DC at that time of year ?

Frank

thanks for the interesting article on the McEwan chap
Wholley
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Post by Wholley »

Marina.
Errm...Yep.Take some warm clothing,gets a little cool up there anytime after September.You could suggest the conference be moved to a state with less inclement weather.I would suggest NC,but I'm a little biased :wink:
Wholley.
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Post by USARMY_ »

I think this is an unwise decision. Americans enjoy easy movement all over Europe and Britania. I feel we should exchange the same courtesy to British and European citizens.

Biometeric security systems would completely eliminate criminals or "known" terrorists movement through our airports. Our gov't should really look into facial recognition and retinal and iris recognition.

PS, Bush hd nothing to do with this decission. Our gov't doesn't work like that. This is a decission was made by the State Department. Bush more than likely isn't even aware of it...

BTW, if you hate Bush, Kerry wants to put a .50 cent tax on every gallon of gasoline sold in the US. AS if gas prices aren't high enough!!!! How would you like to pay $3.oo for low octane gas while on business or holiday?
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