Hi there I'm just in the middle of reading a book, For Queen and Country by Nigel "Spud" Ely, and in the book he talks about the LMG but doesn't actually mention what weapon it actually is.
So I was wondering, out of curiosity, if anyone here knows what light machine gun was used by the Paras around the time of the Falklands War.
I've only ever seen either an SLR or a GPMG in pics from that time period so was wondering if it was just a GPMG used in the light role or was it a totally different weapon?
Thanks in advance.
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LMG used in the Falklands
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Doc
- Guest
Being a medic I may get this one wrong, but Ive started so I'll finish.
The LMG (Light Machine Gun) is also know as the Bren. It was still being used at the time (Falklands) by the forces and upto the introduction of the SA80 series of weapons. I dont know the dispersal pattern of the Bren in a unit, how many etc.
I did fire it once, at a gun club.
Doc
The LMG (Light Machine Gun) is also know as the Bren. It was still being used at the time (Falklands) by the forces and upto the introduction of the SA80 series of weapons. I dont know the dispersal pattern of the Bren in a unit, how many etc.
I did fire it once, at a gun club.
Doc
Yes boxingmad. He is my mates uncle and he used 2 names for a bit for security reasons.Boxingmad wrote:Is that the same guy who wrote under the name "Steve Devereux"?
Doc is correct. The LMG refered to in "For Queen and Country" is the Bren. I havnt heard it being mentioned in any other Falklands war books, but i have seen a picture of it being used during the conflict (cant remember which book though).
I wondered why the mag was different.got1 wrote:The picture shown by Doc : Mark 3 (303), Mark 4 (7.62).
How heavy is the bren? It doesn't look 'light'.
(and on a side note was the Ak74 really 4.85mm calibre when it was first introduced because everything Ive read says it was developed specifically for the 5.45mm, but I read on this forum that it was 4.85 at first)
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Alfa
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I think the book is practically the same. It tells of his time in 2 Para both in N Ireland and in the Falklands war. Then it goes into his life in the SAS. It's written from the heart, which I liked. The start of it is great with an insight into the harsh life at Depot Para in Aldershot. It's well worth getting.
If you're keen on the Paras to SAS thing, then CQB by Mike Curtis is good. Also Killing Zone by Harry McCallion (hard to get these days) is a cracker too.
If you're keen on the Paras to SAS thing, then CQB by Mike Curtis is good. Also Killing Zone by Harry McCallion (hard to get these days) is a cracker too.
Remember, knowledge is power, unless you forget it all.
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anglo-saxon
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The mag on the .303 Bren is more curved than the 7.62mm as the .303 round is a rimmed round and the 7.62mm is a rimless round. This was the first LMG I ever used (L4A6 with chrome lined barrel) early 80's in 7.62mm). It was a sweet gun to fire. 540 rpm average cyclic rate as I recall - much slower than the jimpy - but handy for ammo conservation in a mag-fed weapon. I saw a couple of "runaway guns" in this model, where the gun kept firing after the trigger was released. Quite disconcerting for the firer! I still recall the unload drills..."Cock gun, mag off, look inside, squeese off, top cover, botom cover, sights, change leaver!" I also saw a pheasant fly through a hail of bullets delivered by a dozen LMGs at Ash ranges in '83. How it didn't disintegrate in mid-air I will never know.
Ref the Mark 3, we kept them for quite a while after the L4 came out because we could use them to fire blanks on ex. They had a different barrel fitted, a round with a wooden head was used which broke up at the end of the special barrel before it came out. This was before BFAs came out..
A/S, nice to see you back.
A/S, nice to see you back.
Found pamphlet: BREN.
It is a gas operated, air cooled, fed with .303 ammo from a box magazine with a capacity for 30 rounds, weighs 23lbs, measures 45.5ins.
This pamphlet (Know your weapons) was printed in 1942. It had the following story:
A civilian who was assisting in the evacuation of Dunkirk, was instructed to take his boat to be fitted with a gun, he was asked by a CPO what sort he wanted.
"How about a Bren?" he asked. "Handy little tools, aren't they?"
"Had he ever fired one?" he was asked "No,"he answered.
Then: "Take my advice, chum," replied the CPO., "and fix yourself up with a Lewis. Brens are to bloody accurate. With a Lewis you get plenty of spray, and that, plus the motion of your cockle-shell, should keep you out of trouble."
It is a gas operated, air cooled, fed with .303 ammo from a box magazine with a capacity for 30 rounds, weighs 23lbs, measures 45.5ins.
This pamphlet (Know your weapons) was printed in 1942. It had the following story:
A civilian who was assisting in the evacuation of Dunkirk, was instructed to take his boat to be fitted with a gun, he was asked by a CPO what sort he wanted.
"How about a Bren?" he asked. "Handy little tools, aren't they?"
"Had he ever fired one?" he was asked "No,"he answered.
Then: "Take my advice, chum," replied the CPO., "and fix yourself up with a Lewis. Brens are to bloody accurate. With a Lewis you get plenty of spray, and that, plus the motion of your cockle-shell, should keep you out of trouble."
I love the GPMG. Its a beast of a weapon. Really fast rate of fire, and delivers a hell of a punch. Brilliant fun to fire aswell. Not as accurate as the bren because its an "area weapon" designed to deliver a spread of rounds over a killing area. But all in all, it is great and is 70% of a sections firepower. Just a bitch to clean!! What was the bren like cleaning-wise??
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anglo-saxon
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Jobag wrote:I love the GPMG. Its a beast of a weapon. Really fast rate of fire, and delivers a hell of a punch. Brilliant fun to fire aswell. Not as accurate as the bren because its an "area weapon" designed to deliver a spread of rounds over a killing area. But all in all, it is great and is 70% of a sections firepower. Just a bitch to clean!! What was the bren like cleaning-wise??
"Punch" - as in "retained energy determined by ballistic co-efficient" is indeed substantial. The 7.62 x 51 mm NATO (.308 Winchester in commercial parlance) is a decent all-round, uh, round. Since the .30-30 (designed for lever guns) became less popular (actually no round has put more venison on the table in N. America) because bolt actions took over in popularity both as military and hunting rifles (and able to take more efficient pointed rounds, which the tube magazine-equipppd lever guns are not), the .308 Winchester is probably second only in popularity to the .30-06.
If I were told "all your guns have to go, save one", it would be the Savage mod. 110 heavy barrel in .308 Win. An outstanding combination.
The 7.62 X 39mm Russian (or "Soviet" as we used to call it) is a lesser round to say the least. Less energy retention, less penetration, etc. Having said that, it also has less recoil, hence I am giving my eldest boy a Czek SKS for Crimble. Enough to do the job hunting-wise, but less recoil to have to handle. By the way, the most accurate ammunition ever developed is called the 6mm PPC (initials of the guys who developed it) which is a "necked-down" 7.62 X 39. It produces 5-rd "one ragged hole" groups at 100m from a decent gun. D'oh! Someone got me rabbiting about guns and bullets again!!! Sorry folks!
The jimpy is a wonderful machine and the drills on it also are set permanently into my muscle memory. In fact one of our WOs sprung an impromptue TOET on me the other day (litterally as I was walking by - the bugger!) and it was like I had just passed my course at the Shyte And Shovel Corps! The hands just knew where to go and what to do."
The "MINIMI" or C9 as it is designated here, is as successful as it is because it's guts are just a 5.56mm version of the jimpy. In three years, the jimpy will be 50 years old - that's pretty good going! Cleaning-wise not a problem. Everyone chips in. There's no collars on the gas plugs any more as they are all co-ax barrels these days.
got1 - alright, mate? Good to "see" you!
