Vietnam/real life/tactics

[GD]

some guys did it just because of the thrill of active service. Nearly did it myself.

[Wholley]

Ooops, sorry now that I`ve told you that, I`m afraid I`ll have to kill you

Have to 'kin find me first,And you'll have to join the line/Queue.

You ain't seen me right? ....Right?

[Redleg]

I have just watched the film "We were soldiers" with Mel Gibson in it. I have also read the book and have a couple of questions.

1. Would a CO realy stay at the front with his men?

2. The tactics used in this first large scale Vietnam battle seemed suicidal, do soldiers realy jump off of choopers firing wildly into hedges, this is how it is portrayed in the film.

3. The tactics seemed to be advance at all costs, would a modern battle be run along the same lines?

4. What is the acceptable casualty rate in a modern battle?

Sorry if these are annoying questions for real vets I have nothing but respect for you and any mates you lost in action.

Cheers
Si.

Having read the book and seen the film, there is a difference between the facts in the book and some fiction to make the film more interesting, I think.

I'll try to answer your questions with the knowledge I have.

1. The Lt Col would often times observe the battle from a chopper at 800 feet. Col Moore, as I understand it requested to be on the ground with his unit. His boss, Col Brown pulles the ovehead in the C&C chopper and at one time requested to land and view the action from the ground. Lt Col Moore denied the request and continued command of the grounf action and the continued lift-in of the rest of the unit.
Moore did not fight on the line as he immediately set up a CP in the center rear of the action for command and control.
2. Infantry does junp off the chopper is the LZ is predetermined to be "Hot". This is for two reasons: To get the troops on the ground fast and to prevent the chopper from substaining a high rate of incomming fire.
Since the LZ was not immediate hot on landing of the first lift, the troopers fired off several rounds to draw enemy fire to prevent walking as a unit in to an ambush.
3. The tactic at that time was "Search and Destroy", but not advance at all cost as the Americans had ample air and arty support at their disposal. What happened was the unit started to search and then ended up in a defensive battle as they landed in to a NVA command center of a Battlion sized force.
4. The casualty rate would I assume be pinned on a larger scale operation say like D-Day or Operation Market Garden. I suppose the upper Mucky-mucks may have had numbers on larger scale Ops in Nam, but they surly kept them from us in the field.
Hope this helps.

[Doc]

Redleg, Cambridgebloke died under strange circumstances many moons ago. What was strange? It didnt happen sooner! (didnt die as such but some of us were sharpening knives and trying to bribe Mi5 for info on his location) He asked and commentated on some of the most bone subjects going in a way that made eyes roll to excess!

Interesting replies though bud and welcome to the forums!

[themattmeister]

With regards to question 1. I watched the battle of Falluja recently on News Night and the Colonel involved was running around with his M16 in tow and cigar in mouth dishing out the orders. Only in America.

[Redleg]

With regards to question 1. I watched the battle of Falluja recently on News Night and the Colonel involved was running around with his M16 in tow and cigar in mouth dishing out the orders. Only in America.

That's a Yank for you...always mugging for the news camera's. Seems like it's one of our national pastimes.

[Wholley]

Only in America.

I think that should read"Only in Falluja"
Your not there are you?
Thought not.
Keep your little thoughts in your little mind

[themattmeister]

themattmeister wrote:
Only in America.

I think that should read"Only in Falluja"
Your not there are you?
Thought not.
Keep your little thoughts in your little mind

One of my "little thoughts" is going to escape my "little mind." Although a worn out platitude the phrase "only in America" is a reference to the unique way Americans have of doing things. You don't have to live in America it is quite obvious from where I am now as streams of American popular culture are being heard about on television and read about in newspapers nationwide. You cannot deny the crazyness of the Jerry Springer Show, kids shooting up schools, extroverted population and a massive muder rate per capita are but a few examples to prove the relevance of the accurate phrase "only in America" or "only in Falluja".

[GD]

Would this be an appropriate time to remind posters that Col H Jones VC was killed whilst in the van of the battle?

There are circumstances that require a CO to be right at the front.

[Wholley]

You cannot deny the crazyness of the Jerry Springer Show, kids shooting up schools, extroverted population and a massive muder rate per capita

Jerry Springer got himself canceled two years ago.Your watching re-runs.
The murder/Invasive crime rate per capita is now higher in Great Britain than the US.
Just an aside,Murder is spelled with an"R"

[GD]

You cannot deny the crazyness of the Jerry Springer Show, kids shooting up schools, extroverted population and a massive muder rate per capita

Jerry Springer got himself canceled two years ago.Your watching re-runs.
The murder/Invasive crime rate per capita is now higher in Great Britain than the US.
Just an aside,Murder is spelled with an"R"

Wholley, I can't take issue with the Jerry Springer stuff and I'm certainly not a 'Yank Basher' but I wonder why you make that point about murder/crime?

I honestly can't see the pro rata crime over here being higher than in the US. If you could show me any figures on that I would be very interested.

[/i]

[Cliodna]

Jerry Springer got himself canceled two years ago.Your watching re-runs.

Unfortunately for us Wholley,
Jerry...Jerry...Jerry!! Has come home to Blighty and is now inflicting a UK version of his crap show on our daytime TV, full of chavs and wasters.

Well we live in hope, that maybe one day he will be cancelled here too

[harry hackedoff]

The other Aitch was indeed killed in the van, what many have asked is what for? Why was the Colonel in charge of what was at best an extremely dangerous enterprise taking out fire trenches with the point section. Did this,
A) Make the situation better?
B) Make the situation far worse due to the total lack of direction which ensued.

Well done, the Toms.

[GD]

The other Aitch was indeed killed in the van, what many have asked is what for? Why was the Colonel in charge of what was at best an extremely dangerous enterprise taking out fire trenches with the point section. Did this,
A) Make the situation better?
B) Make the situation far worse due to the total lack of direction which ensued.

Well done, the Toms.

From what I remember H went forward to have a look and felt that the troops needed to be spurred on so he led a bayonet charge.

I think it's a matter of opinion whether or not he helped the situation. I know that his soldiers were loyal and said it did. I wasn't there.

[sneaky beaky]

There is no doubt that Col "H" was extemely courageous. But why was he leading what was in effect a platoon/company attack? He should have been at the rear HQ directing Ops. Didn't he think that his Company Commander could handle it? Or was he just looking for a bit of glory?
And if any Para's are reading this and violently disagree, I'm sorry. I'm not being detrimental to a very brave man. Just pointing out the obvious.
Sneaky