Control room-documentary

[Tab]

Edwards 159..... If you could remeber back far enough you would know that after WW2 there was a huge ammount of sympathy for the Jewish people. Now there was not a back lash here when they murdered our troops out there when they hanged, shot and blew them up, for carrying out a UN Mandate. Now I can understand their need for security and to track down and kill the men that attack them, I can understand them having a large military forces and even the bomb after what they have been through over the last few thousand years. What I can't go along with is for Israel to expand into Palestine and execpt them to be happy about it.
What has been happening is that a small group will move into an area, then complain to their army that they are being harassed by the locals. The army then come in and knocks down the Palestians houses for the protection of the Israelis who then take over that ground as well. They also demand that they have free access to other parts of Israel so the army clears all Palestian houses along the road, and if the complain or demostrate they are all classed as terrorist. Now the Palestinians have tried building harbours and airports, which have all been smashed by Israel so that every thing that is imported into Palestine has to go through Israel first. Now with all the suicide bombers that have attacked Israel, the Palestinians are still still being killed at nearly 10 to for every Iserali that is killed. Now Israel states that it will give land back in Gazza strip, well that land is nothing but sand and is good for nothing, but they are taking even more land on the West Bank from the Palestinians to give to people from Gazza, now you tell me who is getting the best deal. Israel has also bombed water irrigation system that the Arabs have built up on the borders of Syria as they say it is affecting the flow of water in the river Jordan in Israel, but do they worry about the ammount that they use and how their neighbours fare futher down the river. Now it would appear to me that all Israel does is shout terrorist and then do what ever they want to their neighbours. Now I am not blaming all the Israelis for this problem, like many other countries they have their fanatics that are stirring the pot and causing much of this problem, but while there is such a large and powerful Jewsih lobby in America this problem will run and run.

[Jon]

I think the problem with British media is that they don't give you the news but there opinion on it-whether it's right or wrong, thankfully most people can see through the crap and form there own opinions but some people still read The Sun (for instance) to see whats going on in the world.

I agree. Tabloid newpapers do give opinions rather than news, but they hold a lot of influence because millions of people read them. I think that the media played a huge part in turning the British people against Saddam (according to polls most people supported the war). 'Leaked reports' were printed all the time claiming that Iraq 'would have nukes in 2 years' for example, which had the effect of making people paranoid.
These papers play on peoples minds to sell thier papers, espcially the conservative ones like the Mail and Express. Read the broadsheets for unbiased and thorough reporting.

[Jon]

I think the problem with British media is that they don't give you the news but there opinion on it-whether it's right or wrong, thankfully most people can see through the crap and form there own opinions but some people still read The Sun (for instance) to see whats going on in the world.

I agree. Tabloid newpapers do give opinions rather than news, but they hold a lot of influence because millions of people read them. I think that the media played a huge part in turning the British people against Saddam (according to polls most people supported the war). 'Leaked reports' were printed all the time claiming that Iraq 'would have nukes in 2 years' for example, which had the effect of making people paranoid.
These papers play on peoples minds to sell thier papers, espcially the conservative ones like the Mail and Express. Read the broadsheets for unbiased and thorough reporting.

About the argument that Bush is in idiot, I have to disagree. The man has graduated from university and risen to head of his political party, as well as being given the responsibility to fly an airplane. However, i once heard Bush does not read and infact prides himself for it. I am sure that Bush is an intelliget individual, but is he suitable as leader of America if he is ignorant of world events and traits? Also, dont forget that the Presidency is more than one man. Bush is surrounded by advisors and administration members who have a lot of influence over him. I reckon that Bush is simply easily led and influenced, and unable to make his own decisions under pressure. However, I also beleive that Bush himself was one of the main pro-war hawks and was not concerned with the consequences of invading Iraq, only that it was what the American public wanted. A president who had a wdier grasp of world situations would nothave ordered war so readily, especially in a region so unstable as the Middle East.

[Frank S.]

Dear "Sunshine in Seattle": I know full well you are going to read this. You’d ‘promised’ in the first few days of your joining to post less and proceeded to violate that right away, so your words count for nothing.
If you have grievances such as: “I see a fair number of comments equally pointed as mine that don't seem to be challenged by mods or anyone else […] I have always been much more interested in the military history, books and so forth, and am somewhat disappointed that there's so little activity on that part of this site. I have hoped to learn a lot more than I have here. I also was disappointed to have gotten so little response to my posting about the potential vulnerability of the telecom system to an attack. This is a subject I know a fair amount about, but it drew little comment here.’
What you do is look for it elsewhere.
But if you don’t, this means you have other priorities.
In your intro, you said “Hey guys, I might be a civilian but I am definitely an Internet veteran. No one has ever beaten me in an on-line pissing match. Just wait. I vastly prefer a third digit in someone's I.Q., though. It's no fun arguing against vacuous sloganeers” and proceeded to show yourself for exactly that which you criticized.
But you also created expectations with those initial claims, and by doing so opened yourself up to be challenged, and what I’ve seen, today being the latest example, is a lot of delusion on your part.
For someone who claims to be so interested in military history, and posted only on 3 threads in that forum, but on 29 threads in general miscellaneous and 6 in political affairs that complaint holds no water.
As to your topic on the vulnerability of the telecom system, I’m surprised no one brought up the subject of operational security. Whether that information is available from open sources doesn’t matter. Why post on the internet something like this, if not to just show off?
No. The most honest statement you ever made about your intentions was this: “No one has ever beaten me in an on-line pissing match. Just wait.”
Some things still puzzle, though: if you have two mentally challenged nephews which you refer to in your post as “retarded nephews” (you simply don’t get it do you?), I hope they don’t see, much less hear from your negative, rotten ass.
You’re no 20 year old kid so you don’t get slack as they do. Your empty apology for using the term retarded again and again means absolutely nothing.
That you carry a chip on your shoulder the size of New Jersey and take it out on others less fortunate means YOU are nothing.
Barely a piss-ant with a keyboard.
You tell us this isn’t working, and so what you’re going to do is take a couple weeks off? You don’t get to dictate anything. Not one thing.
This whole post of yours is simply another one of your chickenshit insults. Take a long walk off a short pier, you have no conscience and no honor.
And in yet another ironic twist, your new signature, also intended as some passive-aggressive parting shot (why draw attention to it otherwise?), actually applies to anyone BUT you.

You are an oxygen thief.

[Whitey]

Well Snyder I warned you and told you. You pissed off Frank, take two weeks and come back relaxed. Want military questions answered, ask. But ask in a straight foward way. I'm a tinfoil hat life member, but not everything is a conspiracy and no one here wants to fight it out on the politics of who is better John or George. They both are sell outs. One supports the Aristocracy the other the litterally unwashed, unshaven and uncitizen. Who cares at this point who gets elected? Both are crooks with ugly wives. Accept that, swallow it and when you get back we can discuss 81mm mortars, morophine doses to the injured on the battle field, what pill gets rid of travelers diarrhea, which one makes the rash go away and which one makes you piss red.
There are lots of military threads here, look one up and ask away.
See you in two weeks.

[Edwards159]

Edwards 159..... If you could remeber back far enough you would know that after WW2 there was a huge ammount of sympathy for the Jewish people. Now there was not a back lash here when they murdered our troops out there when they hanged, shot and blew them up, for carrying out a UN Mandate. Now I can understand their need for security and to track down and kill the men that attack them, I can understand them having a large military forces and even the bomb after what they have been through over the last few thousand years. What I can't go along with is for Israel to expand into Palestine and execpt them to be happy about it.
What has been happening is that a small group will move into an area, then complain to their army that they are being harassed by the locals. The army then come in and knocks down the Palestians houses for the protection of the Israelis who then take over that ground as well. They also demand that they have free access to other parts of Israel so the
army clears all Palestian houses along the road, and if the complain or demostrate they are all classed as terrorist. Now the Palestinians have tried building harbours and airports, which have all been smashed by Israel so that every thing that is imported into Palestine has to go through Israel first. Now with all the suicide bombers that have attacked Israel, the Palestinians are still still being killed at nearly 10 to for every Iserali that is killed. Now Israel states that it will give land back in Gazza strip, well that land is nothing but sand and is good for nothing, but they are taking even more land on the West Bank from the Palestinians to give to people from Gazza, now you tell me who is getting the best deal. Israel has also bombed water irrigation system that the Arabs have built up on the borders of Syria as they say it is affecting the flow of water in the river Jordan in Israel, but do they worry about the ammount that they use and how their neighbours fare futher down the river. Now it would appear to me that all Israel does is shout terrorist and then do what ever they want to their neighbours. Now I am not blaming all the Israelis for this problem, like many other countries they have their fanatics that are stirring the pot and causing much of this problem, but while there is such a large and powerful Jewsih lobby in America this problem will run and run.

Tab i totally agree with you there. Its like everything it all comes down to greed. Were you refering to the bombing of the king david Hotel?. The British trained there army. Known as the Haganah

[Redhand]

I don't know...

I just take a different angle on it,

Look...i've had some good friends who've been put in hospital beds in NI by republican thugs. These same republican thugs have classy murals decorating their walls with slogans such as 'PLO/IRA...One Struggle'.

We've all seen it. And we all know that it was the IRA who originally trained the PLO how to use explosives effectively. This training merely passed on to Hamas.

Israel lives in a constant state of defense, same as the Loyalists of NI. I just don't get British sympathy for the palestinians, especially when they should understand the constant threat of cold blooded murder.

Tab,

You pointed out that the death ratio for palestinians is 10/1 over the death of Isrealies. The obvious factor in my mind is that 99% of the palestinians killed are combatants/terrorists, whereas its usually Israeli civillians who pay the price.

Israelies don't jump on busses dressed up as rabbi's and send little children to a horrible death.

[Edwards159]

The obvious factor in my mind is that 99% of the palestinians killed are combatants/terrorists, whereas its usually Israeli civillians who pay the price

.

How the hell did you work that one out?? 99% of palestinians killed are combatants/terrorists. If palestinians protest peacefully they got. If they refuse to get out of there homes they get shot. Believe it or not but not every palestinian is a terrorist. As they are normally portrayed by the west. More now than ever.

[Redhand]

If they have nothing to hide when the IDF is doing a sweep, why don't they leave their homes?

[Jon]

You cannot justify collective punishment.

Israeli's dont send out suicide bombers because they have tanks, helicopters and airplanes to do the bombings for them. You can not force someone into a situation, as the Palestinians are in at the moment, without expecting them to react. Suicide bombings are simply another form of warfare used by the Palestinians because they have little other means of fighting. However terrorism is never justified and the taking of innocent lives is appauling.

[Redhand]

Not quite sure I understand,

The acts they commit are understandable but not justified?

[Spannerman]

Jon makes some very valid points. The situation in Israel/Palestine has been simmering since biblical days, nothing will change unless Israel becomes the USA's 51st state, if ever that happens then God help us all!

[Seven]

If they have nothing to hide when the IDF is doing a sweep, why don't they leave their homes?

So when a foreign power enters your town and wants to sweep your house you would let them without protest?

[dootybooty]

Redhand, lets simplify all the polemic. What Israel is doing to the Palestinians is not fair. Maybe we Brits have a sense of fairplay that outwieghs your rationality. Remember we first went into Ulster in 69 to protect the Catholics from the Prods. I know, I was there. Although there are comparisons with Ulster and Palestine things have moved on. In the Israel/Palestine conflict there has been no improvement since 1967.

[El Prez]

Take it easy Snyder.
Cliogggyneeda, come down off the chandelier, we can see your obvious lack of undergarments. Nice thought but unnecessary, we'll still love you in the morning.
Relax all, group hug, grab a tree. Not that, it's my leg.