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Since joining the forums a while ago, I have seen national service referred to as "the solution" to a whole range of problems in modern day Britain. Is anyone reading this who actually thinks this? If any of you are, then please explain your reasoning in this thread and then, hopefully, it will turn into a good ol' fashioned debate! Also, if I get anyone laying out why they think it then I will outline why it is not the solution to any problems, so...

"This house would never reintroduce national service"

Get amongst it

It would never happen again in the UK but it can only be good for people.

+1

Even though it may be a solution to certain social problems, which I doubt, it will mean a weakening of the armed forces. Professional, highly motivated, well-trained men and women will be replaced by people who do not wish to be in the army, who will be in the army for a year, year and a half maybe, and therefor do not gain any experience. Also I don't think it's possible to send draftees to a warzone like Iraq. If you want more Abu Graib type situations that's the thing to do. The social problems that may exist should be solved where they develop, by school and by parents.

how about a type of community service, getting people to do work for their local communities instead?.

This might instill some pride in their community and put a hold on some of the yobbish behaviour which im sure all of us have seen.

Think of it. We currently have the most professional armed forces in the world, if one of the smallest. An all volunteer force made up (mostly) of people who want to be there. They are enthusiastic and want to get the job done, so the UK Armed Forces have a brilliant reputation for professionalism. Imagine thousands of ppl there who don't want to be there, who drag their feet at every oppurtunity and who, in war, you would be scared to have next to you on the line.

Add to that the fact that the MoD cannot even supply and resup the current army, the fact that the few thousand in Iraq go out on patrol with 20 rounds, and you can see that national service would be an apalling waste of time and money, and completly ruin the character and ethic of the armed forces, a status quo that I imagine most on this site would want to maintain.

Chris

During National Service Times we had the fourth largest Army in the world. Now the National Servicemen had to carry out the same duties as a regular for a fraction of the pay. Also you get less leave and rail passes,
also most of the men that fought in Korea, Malaya, Kenya, Cyprus,Suez and numerous other little conflicts where National Servicemen. Now due to balls up by a person in the Ministry of Labour my apprenticeship papers where not processed so I got called up a few weeks before my final exams for City & Guilds Electrical Engineering. They would only allow me to sit the exams if I signed on for a minimum of nine years, Well I wont tell you what my reply was to that, but I was not in a good frame of mind during my Army time, like many of the men that I served with. I wound up in the Parachute Regiment for my sins, and I will admit I had a great time with them and made a lot of good friends, but i still did not want to be a soldier. Now I had been having a great time working in Cinemas, theatres and film sets, I had got quite used to going out with some of the most beautiful young women in the world and could think of better ways of spending my time than marching across deserts getting shot at

I would suggest giving them the training and a taste of the discipline, but any unit comprised of conscripts wouldn't be as effective as a unit of volunteers.
If duties were kept, as suggested, to a form of hyper-community service (but still distanced from any kind of demeaning manual labour) then National Service can only benefit the country.

Get these youngsters into uniform, change them from boys to men, put them in the support units, cooks, clerks, etc., and leave the regulars to do the professional jobs.

Let us have some discipline back into our way of life and that includes my two grandsons who think the world owes them a living!

I think it would do a lot of kids a lot of good if they were forced to do a year or so of compulsory civil service, send them off, give them a good dose of discipline etc etc and send them to work in the community.
Regarding the military though, I don't think it's a terribly good idea, as my dad always says: A volunteer is worth ten pressed men.

Would you only apply National Service to lads? Round here it's hard to tell the difference between boys and girls unless it's saturday night... *
They all hang about outside the local off-licence in tracksuit bottoms (tucked into their socks), Rockport/Timberland jumpers and baseball caps, trying to get people to buy alcohol or fags for them, and being abusive if you refuse. Give them all a taste of military discipline!

*on saturday night the dress code for girls changes to 'as little as your mam will let you out of the house in', and lots of make-up.

Females as well as guys, especially those that want equal rights! Let's see what their fingernails would be like after a stretch on the Assault Course, those that are in a group of four or more outside your supermarket put these in to servicing tanks, ten or more put in the Rifle Brigade, that should quicken their pace a bit!

Spannerman you said that National Servicemen should only be cooks and clerks, well most of the fighting for years was done by National Servicemen, are you decrying what they did while they were in the Forces.
Also in this time of equal oppurtunity all youngster should do it then. What I would like to see is some form of labour gang where those they have not worked for any length of time would have to spend time on it doing a bit of hard labour for there dole money.

Tab wrote:Spannerman you said that National Servicemen should only be cooks and clerks, well most of the fighting for years was done by National Servicemen, are you decrying what they did while they were in the Forces.
Also in this time of equal oppurtunity all youngster should do it then. What I would like to see is some form of labour gang where those they have not worked for any length of time would have to spend time on it doing a bit of hard labour for there dole money.

while i agree in principle that those who are capable of working should contribute to the country. Cold yu imagine the field day the human rights laywers would have?.

I remember when the police videotaped a drug dealer selling schoolkids hard drugs. The defense argued the dealers "rights to privacy " were impinged.

So, forcing people to work would definetely fall foul of the laywers im afraid.

National Non Military service with military discipline is what is required. What people over look is the simple fact that being disciplined makes you self disciplined. Also living with a bunch of strangers teaches you tolerance and respect for other people. Both traits sadly lacking in todays society.
Re instituting a disciplined form of National Service could only benefit the inadequate youths we all see every day.

Tab wrote:Spannerman you said that National Servicemen should only be cooks and clerks, well most of the fighting for years was done by National Servicemen, are you decrying what they did while they were in the Forces.

Not at all, most did a splendid job, if I had not 'volunteered as a regular' I would have done my two years as a NS, it is some of the layabouts today that need a good kick up the jacksy and these are the ones that should be brought in to support those at the sharp end.

I always recall a chap telling me that in the 1970's he was a persistent minor criminal offender, the magistrate gave him one last chance join the Army or go to a young offenders institute, he chose the Army and he changed his attitude.