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Hi all

Just wondering what peoples onpinions are on which Army in the World has the best Individual Weapon (IW) and Equipment, and why you think they do.

Just a matter of interest - I've been trying to do some research on the topic

Thanks all
GJimbo

Rebels....ak47's all the way, never seem to jam and will be around for ever!

The British Army

Mind you I've never used anything else

Steyr AUG is a good rifle.

I'd say us or the Yanks. Our procurment policies are some of the most open and we have the money to spend. Because of that we get the best stuff, eg the home grown ALARM missile, the WAH-64 from the US, the Typhoon from europe and here (yes despite the costs it's still better than every other apart from the F-35 and F/A-22), PAAMS, etc etc. Most other countries consentrate on either there own stuff or go with US stuff because of politics, all those left over just go with whatever they can get.

It is really all a matter of personal choice, what one person likes another may hate. Also weapons hve there own type use's some are good for one type of warfare and may be not any good for another type of use.

i think the m16 is the best weapon and that the British Army should swallow their pride and use them.

I believed the lectures. The SA80 is an effective weapon if maintained well and the soldier is trained well in the handling and coached well in shooting, which is certainly the case in the British Army.

So what if the British Army switched to the M16, all your skill-at-arms people need retraining not long after the training for the previous weapon system had been perfected? Not something to be entered into lightly. How many units would still be using the SA80 years later?

Then there's the simplistic argument, the Yanks are increasingly getting away from the M16 because of the relatively long length, which is proving to be Hummer and armoured vehicle user-unfriendly in Iraq.

Soldiers in training may develop a bad impression of the SA80 because they may end up with a cannabalized rifle which simply doesn't fit together as well as one with all the original parts.

The firing pins breaking is something that can be solved without switching to a new rifle as well, just try different materials. Drill bit manufacturers probably solved the problem decades ago.

I'd be interested to know how many serving soldiers genuinely believe that the SA80 is inherently flawed and therefore, all their exhaustive training was of no use.

if they're having trouble with the long barrel.. wouldnt they use the M4? because thats the shorter barreled version..

and btw AK-47 is difficult to fire from prone position.. the 30 round mag sorta lifts if off the ground making it hard to aim with..

about the SA-80.. i heard in theory its a perfect rifle.. just a few engineering defects in the production of it sorta screwed it right.. maybe in a few models time they might sort out the few problems with it..

im not in the army... so all i know is from books.. and air cadets..

All bear in mind that the M-16 was hardly the perfect weapon when it was first introduced. It took many years and a lot of needless deaths before it was perfected. Read this article for more info http://www.jouster.com/articles30m1/

Having used the SA80 when it was first issued I was really impressed with it against the SLR

No pain in the bum grooves on the bolt carrier to clog up, better gas plug etc

I went on exercise in sandy conditions for a week and mine never jammed once, compared to the SLR in the same conditions where I ended up cranking the rounds through by hand !

I think the main problem is the quality of the materials used was not up to expectations

I also think this subject has been done to death many times !

I haven't heard that many complaints about the SA80A2. The A1 was that bad by all accounts but I've read the MoD test reports and the report on Iraq and the SA80 got some good praises, espescially in the reliability terms. It fires something like 25000 rounds before jamming in tests so I think they've solved most of the problems. The only one I've heard of that's left is the difficulty in magazine seating but that should be fixed soon and something can be rigged up to help it in the short term.

Space cadet, the yanks don't use the M4 because it has a shorter barrel, and so less range and accuracy.

As we have talked about all this before the SA 80 was orginal built in the 1940's and had been changed a bit over the years. The reason it was not adopted before by the British Army was becuase of the presures to have a standard NATO rifle bullet, hence the FN SLR. In the 70's all the governments went there own way, and the British Government adopted the SA 80 as a way to sell of the the British Small Arms industries. The SA 80 spec's made it a cheap and cheerful replacement, even if they did charge the government a lot more for them. By adopting the SA 80 the British army also managed to get rid of a number of other weapons, like the Stirling sub machine gun, the General purpose machine gun, so that they only had one main bullet to get to the troops and that was the .280.
The SA80 mk2 is a much better weapon, well it has greater reliability, along with a great sight on it and it's compact design makes it much easier to handle.
Now if it is that bad a design why have so many countries brought out their own designs based on the SA 80, I think you will find that nearly every major country has a similar type of weapon in it's arsenal.

How many people who slag off the SA80 have fired it in the field.

I have fired the Cadet Issue on a 3 day Exercise and found it to be ok even with mud and sh1te in it. Mind you, you do cock it after each round (sore arm after 6 magazines worth).

Tom

I still fire the cadet issue. Theyre now converting us over to use L85A2 IW and LSW. Ive fired them on camp i got one stoppage in 200 rounds on the LSW and none on IW and this was on a shite day in a muddy field. People whove used them in the field dont complain either